Chalk preference

[Lou]

I used Silver Cup chalk for the first time yesterday and didn't like it nearly as much as I like Master Chalk. Silver Cup was gritty and messy. Master Chalk goes on the tip much cleaner, and I felt like I had better cueball control with Master Chalk.

[Jerry]

Masters all the way, Masters have improved the use of my "hard English" very much with little to none miscues. Although i find the black master chalk to be nice, i would rather have blue ( must be my eyes) just seems better. Might be because i have used blue for 11 yrs.

Jerry

[Lou]

Masters all the way, Masters have improved the use of my "hard English" very much with little to none miscues. Although i find the black master chalk to be nice, i would rather have blue ( must be my eyes) just seems better. Might be because i have used blue for 11 yrs.

Jerry

I read in another forum that the color of the chalk can make a difference in performance, because each pigment has a different chemical compound. The consensus seems to be that blue Master Chalk performs the best. So far, it's my favorite too.

[wabacokid]

I will have to throw in another vote for Master Chalk. As for color, I have been using red since the table I am playing the most on is covered with red cloth.

[mcneguy]

Does the red chalk stain your hands? My table has wine cloth and i use silver cup camel because it is fleshtone and doesn't stain my hands red.

[adesso]

I prefer Silver Cup due to the fact that it doesn't stain my hands. I used Masters for a long time, but changed over to Silver Cup primarily because I wanted to know where my chalk was on the table and not have to worry about someone grabbing it and walking a way with my cube!! Not many people use Silver cup, so I always know that the cube on the table is mine and not someone elses. Plus, it shoots fine for me.

[wabacokid]

Does the red chalk stain your hands? My table has wine cloth and i use silver cup camel because it is fleshtone and doesn't stain my hands red.




The red chalk does stain my hands and therefore also my shaft :( . So I am regularly cleaning my shaft to wash off the red stain. I have thought about using a glove but my stroke just doesn't feel right with a glove. I know it shouldn't make a difference but it does, probably more mental than anything. The best solution is to change the chalk color but that would be too easy, right :idea: .

[Lanny]

McDermott makes a really good chalk.

Master makes McDermot chalk

I had never used Masters until I started reading about chalk. I used Pioneer up until now because the company that I bought the table from gave me a ton of it. A buddy of mine brought me some Masters Chalk with Harley Davidson's name on it. Big difference. I'll use the Masters and let the rest I play against use my old Pioneer.

NTC and Silver Cup... throw them away. They play as well as no chalk at all. Master's is the only chalk. I have not tried Triangle, but do not see a need to either.

[dhammis]

I use black Masters chalk because most of my clothing is black and therefore it doesn't show as badly.

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[txplshrk]

Well I got to go against the grain because I feel Silver cup stays on a hard tip a lot better, and it is a nice soft chalk. It doesn't stain your hands or your clothes or your shaft. I don't like masters because it is a harder chalk, but it might work better on softer tips for all I know. I just know on my tips I didn't like it at all. Oh well, to each their own.

[Black_Cat_5791]

MASTER BEIGE COLOR

BLACK CAT 8)

[kylel]

Master Grey Chalk

I have tried a couple others (Pioneer, Silver Cup, NTC) and I feel that the Masters just stays on my Sniper tip alot better.

[PoolSleuth]

Master GREEN........ :lol:

[PoolSleuth]

Master GREEN........ :lol:

[jsggems]

Master Tan or Gray, it does not stain the shaft. IMO it's the same stuff as the Blue. I hear the Balabushka chalk is not bad, I have not tried it yet tho.

[squirrels]

master or triangle chalk...i actually like triangle chalk alot but i hate silver cup

[willy147]

Master Chalk of course.

[DirtieWork]

Master tan for me

[poohkiller]

Master tan for me

For me too!

[tsuguy]

Master tan here too! 8O

[dags_lax]

It is more than just a matter of some food coloring that gives you different colors of chalk. And because different colored chalks are made differently not all colors do the intended job equally well.

Choosing a chalk based on what matches the cloth of your table, or doesn't stain your shaft is certainly a consideration. And for those of you who feel that pool is a fashion statement and need to accessorize properly with chalk that matches the color of your clothes, I am ok with that to.

But for me I'll choose a chalk based on what does the best job. And that is Master green.

[poohkiller]

It is more than just a matter of some food coloring that gives you different colors of chalk. And because different colored chalks are made differently not all colors do the intended job equally well.

Choosing a chalk based on what matches the cloth of your table, or doesn't stain your shaft is certainly a consideration. And for those of you who feel that pool is a fashion statement and need to accessorize properly with chalk that matches the color of your clothes, I am ok with that to.

But for me I'll choose a chalk based on what does the best job. And that is Master green.

Unfortunately the only thing I can buy here is Master blue (I got the tan from a friend) and tons of Silvercup.. Sooo... :?

[tsuguy]

What characteristics give Master Green it's superiority over any other??? I have never tried green, but the tan I use seems to cover an unscuffed tip much better than blue, and you can also apply a much thinker layer of chalk before all you are doing is just wiping the same chalk around on the tip.

[dags_lax]

What characteristics give Master Green it's superiority over any other???

I don't have robots or sophisticated testing and measuring equipment so I can not offer any empirical evidence as to why Master Green is better other than to say that that happens to be my observation in my 40+ years of playing pool.

And no, I haven't tried every color of every brand out there but for the most part the serious players that I know prefer the Master Green and of those few that don't, the Master Blue.

[tsuguy]

What is better about it??? That's all I'm trying to ask! Coverage? # of miscues? It smells better??? Work with me here!

[dags_lax]

Smells better, Cute, I like that.

The purpose of chalk is to provide friction between the tip and the cue ball on off center hits. Without this friction the cueball slides of the tip, the dreaded miscue.

What I like About the Master Green is that I feel more comfortable and not worrying about a miscue on shots that require a fair amount of spin.

As for how thick you can cover your tip, I have tried chalks that go on thick but still don't inspire me with the confidence I get from a thin layer of Master Green.

[dags_lax]

Here is another consideration when chosing what chalk to use. Especially in a home enviroment. I cut and pasted from posting of mine from three years ago.




I thought I would share this with the forum for those who have young children at home.


Researchers from Phoenix, AZ, report another source of lead exposure--pool cue chalk. They describe two toddlers, ages 28 and 27 months, who had elevated lead concentrations of 35 and 26 ug/dL. Home investigations revealed one child had been seen with pool cue chalk in her mouth, which was found to have over 4000 ppm (mg/kg) lead; the other child held the pool cue chalk for his care giver, and the child was seen to have it in his mouth. A sample contained 7000 ppm lead.

The authors caution that 90% of billiard tables are found in homes, and an entire cube of pool chalk is ground into a fine dust and released into the immediate atmosphere during ordinary use, contaminating the pool table, floor, and surrounding surfaces. Lead may be a component of the chalk, the manufacturing process, or the pigment used for color. To provide some perspective on this hazard, they note that lead-contaminated chalk typically contains 7000 ppm lead, yet residential paint is considered a childhood hazard if the concentration is 5000 ppm, and crayons recently rejected for sale in the U.S. contained 800 ppm.

The authors point out that testing identified certain brand/color combinations as having very low lead levels (Master/red, NTC/green, NTC/red, and Pioneer/blue), and suggest that "because pool cue chalk that is free of significant lead contamination is available, it should preferentially be used, especially when children will be present." (Milller MB et al: Pediatrics, Jun 1996; 97.916-917)


A little follow up info that I found in another artical.


TABLE 1. Chalk Samples Tested by Good Samaritan Regional
Medical Center


Legend for chart:

A - Brand
B - Color
C - Lead, mg/kg

A B C

Crest Blue 30
Imperial Green 20
Master Blue <20
Master Green 7600
Master Green 8000
NTC Black <20
NTC Blue <20
NTC Blue <20
NTC Brown <20
NTC Green 20
NTC Gray <20
NTC Red <20
NTC Tangerine <20
Pioneer Green 7040
ProClassic Blue 20
Silver Cup Blue <20
Sportscraft Blue <20
Superior Gray 20
Superior Tangerine 20
Triangle Brown 20
Triangle Tangerine 30

TABLE 2. Chalk Samples Tested by Mecklenburg County Health
Department

Legend for chart:

A - Brand
B - Color
C - No. of Samples
D - Lead, mg/kg
E - Range, mg/kg

A B C D E

Master Green 8 6833 6200-7330
Master Red 8 9 4-15
NTC Green 2 2.5 2-3
NTC Red 2 1.5 1-2
Pioneer Blue 6 18 17-23
Pioneer Green 8 8059 6830-9630
Pioneer Tangerine 6 9952 8250-14080

[poohkiller]

Smells better, Cute, I like that.

The purpose of chalk is to provide friction between the tip and the cue ball on off center hits. Without this friction the cueball slides of the tip, the dreaded miscue.

What I like About the Master Green is that I feel more comfortable and not worrying about a miscue on shots that require a fair amount of spin.

As for how thick you can cover your tip, I have tried chalks that go on thick but still don't inspire me with the confidence I get from a thin layer of Master Green.

So we can say it's 90% mental 10% physichal..

[tsuguy]

Isn't everything in this game we love to hate?

[dags_lax]

So we can say it's 90% mental 10% physichal

NOT! There is nothing mental about miscueing.

[DirtieWork]

So what ue saying is i might be mildly retarded because of pool cue chalk :twisted:

[poohkiller]

So we can say it's 90% mental 10% physichal

NOT! There is nothing mental about miscueing.

Well I faaaar haven't played as much as pool as you have so please keep in mind that I really-really respect you for all those years and all that experience but in my opinion whenever I don't trust my equipment 100% I definitely make more miscues and mess up with positoning moer often than when I do have 100% trust.. So I think mental status has a lot to do with miscueing. IMO of course.

[dags_lax]

The cue ball does what it does because of the physical forces acting on it. I am not saying that there isn't a metntal aspect to the game. But when you hit your shot, whether you miscue, make the shot, or get your leave, isn't dependent on whether you "think" might happen.

Maybe a Jedi using the force can make up for expecting results that are not possible from how the ball was hit. But for every one else the balls are going to do what they do because of how the cue ball was hit and strategy, hopes, wishes, positive/negative attitudes, etc .... have no effect at all.

[tsuguy]

*** THIS MESSAGE WAS DELETED BECAUSE SOMEONE DIDN'T LIKE THE CONTENT***

[poohkiller]

Pooh,
Don't mind Dax... he's got "set in his own way of thinking disease" and unfortunately this never allows a person to explore all the posibilities in front of them and then in turn limits their ability to perform.

Alright, I won't go into a stupid never-ending arguement, he says what he thinks and I say what I reckon. I understand him and hope he does the same for me - and I'm quite sure in that though..

So, long story short, I understand you dags_lax and also you, tsuguy. Thanks both of you for the deliverences at all.

[tsuguy]

Pooh, your such a peaceful guy! :lol:

[poohkiller]

Pooh, your such a peaceful guy! :lol:

Yes.. There are so few things that are considered to be peaceful, correct and fair and I think (and I hope I'm right) pool was one of these... If we would start arguing, shouting and going rude here we would let other people think that "pool is just one of those sports where competitors and playMATEs just tear each other's heads off for something that just does not matter that much"..
If in real life someone wants to fight then I'll gladly tear his head off, but this is definitely not the right place and atmosphere..

You know what I mean? :wink:

[tsuguy]

Your right... a gentlemens' game it shall stay. That is unless you by that $150,000 cue from McDermott. The Intimidator! You'd literally kill your opponents on and off the table! :lol:

[poohkiller]

Your right... a gentlemens' game it shall stay. That is unless you by that $150,000 cue from McDermott. The Intimidator! You'd literally kill your opponents on and off the table! :lol:

Yeah but before I could do it "I'd slice my arms open!" Neil said that and he's right :-D Until then all I can do is keep throwing chalks at my opponents while they're aiming.. :D :D Nah, just kidding... :twisted: :D

[dags_lax]

In the interest of keeping the forum peacfull I will stay open to the the possibility that the next time I miscue with a well chalked tip that it may have been my mindset rather than the fact that I hit it the cue ball to far from the center.

[poohkiller]

In the interest of keeping the forum peacfull I will stay open to the the possibility that the next time I miscue with a well chalked tip that it may have been my mindset rather than the fact that I hit it the cue ball to far from the center.

:wink: Thanks :-)) I hope that you won't miscue ever, though :-)

[nathar]

Don't get me wrong I bet he's probably a heii of a shot with all those years behind him, but he'll never get better than he is right now with that kind of mentality.


That's a bunch of crap. The real dissapointment here is that neither of you really invested the thought to understand what was being offered to you. To go off on a personal attack, simply because Dags was trying to impress upon you that pool is a game of physics or physical forces, is lame at best.

The point he was trying to make was that regardless of your mental state, the cb reacts based on where you strike it, and how hard you strike it. If your mental state causes you to hit the cb with too much english, then you will miscue because you screwed up.

As far as the chalk issue, what's to be debated? Different chalks are produced by different means with different materials. Of course there will be a difference in the way they work. I've heard from more people than Dag's that there is something about Master Green that gives it an advantage. But you also have to take into consideration the relative humidity in the area where you are shooting. Master chalk seems to be better for more humid areas where as Silver Cup tends to be better suited to dryer areas.

What gets me is that Dag's is posting info that he has looked into rather than just slamming someone that is too lazy to do their own research. And you call him close minded. Grow up.


I'll give pooh a pass since there is a difference in nationality, and there may be some dialog that isn't as clear as it could be.

[poohkiller]

To go off on a personal attack, simply because Dags was trying to impress upon you that pool is a game of physics or physical forces, is lame at best.


What gets me is that Dag's is posting info that he has looked into rather than just slamming someone that is too lazy to do their own research. And you call him close minded. Grow up..

I can't see where the personal attack was.. I think that I was as polite as possible (or at least I tried to write in a way to show you that I do respect him and his resarches) and I didn't say that he's close minded - I just said that in my opinion miscueing has a lot to do with mental approach. That's it.

So as I see there was no personal attack - even I was the one who didn't wanted to go into an arguement. In Hungarian language there's a good word for disputation and another good one for quarreling. The first one means both of the speakers stand behind their idea and the second one means that the speakers are rude with each other and they don't even care what the main topic was.. Now, quarreling is what I wanted to avoid. So I think there was no personal attack - BUT if there was any, then I do apologize.

[nathar]

If you read the post again, at the end I exempted you from my comments. And at the top of my post, I quoted what I consider to be a personal jibe at Dags. Questioning his mentality when he is trying to offer insight is "dirty pool" at best.

[tsuguy]

Pooh, I am sorry that you were dragged into the middle of this, you did nothing, but keep the peace.

Nathar, I do not apologize for what you see to be a personal shot at Dax. Anything written in a forum is for reference only, you read it, you remember it or you don't. You let it go and move on to the next question/ comment /concern. Or you state your opinion.

My opinion was that this person is at his peak and will never get better with his current mindset. That there is only sooooo much physical in the game of pool. I assure you though that if people in this forum can not take such comments then I will no longer refer to anyone directly, and only hold any words of encouragement or possible improvement to myself. Nothing like a forum where someone can not speak there mind eh?

By the way, Dax... I very much enjoyed all the information you posted! You've obviously done your homework on chalk, and because of your post I have replaced the chalk in my home with a different brand. I'll never know, but you could have saved one of my children from lead poisoning. Thank you.

[dags_lax]

I am not sure what it is about my mindset that is holding me back but any constructive suggestions will be appreciated. A for there being only so much “physical” in the game of pool I whole heartedly agree. But there is more physics that affect the game than most people realize leading to common assumptions (by even very good players) that are flat out wrong. And I am not talking about the minutia that is so inconsequential as to not even needing consideration.

I will give you one example to ponder that I bet the vast majority of members on this forum accept as a fact. On a bank shot, shooting the object ball hard into the rail shortens the angle of rebound.

For now my drinking team is off to the Minnesota State Championships (for pool that is). If no one explains why the above statement is false I will do so upon my return next week.

[poohkiller]

For now my drinking team is off to the Minnesota State Championships (for pool that is).

Good luck in your competition and waiting for your comeback! :wink:

Tsuguy: no problem :-)

Nathar: I've read that, I just didn't wanted to pull myself out of this.. But thanks at all for your kindness :-)

[jkregan]

Dags, does it have anything to do with whether the ball is rolling hard into the rail or sliding hard into the rail? Or should I say cushion?

The effect of speed into the cushion is affected by many variables. Like anything else to do with bank shots, there is no one right answer and that is why bank shots are such a problem for most of us.

Given the information on lead content, I will stick with Master Blue.

[nathar]

I'm letting this go after this post.

I was never asking for an apology. My point is that your judgement of Dags mentality is irrelevant to this discussion. I wonder if that judgement would be likely to change if Dags were to step up to the table and showed that he was by far your superior in pool. Not that he is, but who knows? I just felt that to resort to a personal attack against someone that is offering 40+ years of knowledge and experience because you couldn't stand up to the scrutiny of his argument was something less than mature.

As far as I'm concerned you can say what you want. But when you start attacking people that are trying to help you, I'm not going to stay quiet. Dags has a history of offering good advice on this forum and backing up his statements with facts, not insults.

I think one of the issues is that pool and billiards have been around so long, that most of the physics aspects of the game have been discovered. Yet people are always trying to add other variables to the mix. Truth is, the ball is going to react according to how it is struck. The only time mentality comes into the picture is whether or not you have the knowledge, skill, and ability to strike the ball properly. Everybody makes mistakes, and everybody miscues. When you miscue, it is because you tried to strike the cb is a way that physics would not allow. Whether you meant to or not, or whether you even knew what you were doing when it occured or not. Chalk is merely a piece of technology that allows us to push the envelope. If you are miscueing, it is more likely that you made a real mental mistake 2-3 shots before that caused you to be so far out of line that you were forced to use extreme english. :wink:

[poohkiller]

I'm letting this go after this post.
If you are miscueing, it is more likely that you made a real mental mistake 2-3 shots before that caused you to be so far out of line that you were forced to use extreme english. :wink:

I agree these things and I'm also out of this - but before I do: sorry if I've hurt, attacked or insulted anyone. Like at the ends of the movies: The End (for me, at least)

[tsuguy]

Nathar

You hit the nail on the head... I totally agree.

[dags_lax]

Dags, does it have anything to do with whether the ball is rolling hard into the rail or sliding hard into the rail? Or should I say cushion?


Bingo. Give that man a cuppie doll. Rolling or sliding is the difference. How hard really doesn't make a real (world) difference although there is a theoretical difference because of the amount that the cushion compresses

Set up this shot for proof. It works best on a 9 foot table.

Lay your cue across from the corner pocket to the middle diamond on the side rail. Set 3 balls along your cue with the closest one being an inch or two from the side rail. Now put another ball (to use as a cue ball) behind it. Now do the same thing with three balls closer to the corner pocket. What you now have is the exact same shot with the only difference being distance. The three ball combo removes any slight variations you might have in the angle or spin from the cue ball. Shoot the shot closest to the rail and you will see that the ball will come up short of the pocket. Now shoot the other combo and it should go right in. You can try this shot with different variations in speed and the results should always be the same. The difference is whether the object ball is sliding or rolling into the rail. On the close combo no mater how soft you shot (as long as you have enough speed to get to the other side) the object ball will be sliding into the rail. On the other shot the object ball will have acquired natural roll by the time it gets to the rail.

There is one myth dispelled for my fellow forum members and you should all be a little better on your bank shots for it. You guys have just become betters players with no practice needed. Just from a better understanding of the physics of the game.

This is one free lesson for all of you unless we ever run into each other. Then you can buy me a beer.

[poohkiller]

This is one free lesson for all of you unless we ever run into each other. Then you can buy me a beer.

Thank you for the lesson! I've just got home from the poolhall but I'll try what you said as soon as possible! And when we meet (what would be great) I'd definitly buy you a beer. Or two. :wink: Thanks again.

[jkregan]

In Robert Byrne's volume V power workout, he describes and demonstrates this rather well.

[dags_lax]

This is something I figured out years ago wondering why I would miss a bank that I thought I hit perfect. My original proof came from just hitting the cue ball into the rail with varying speeds, draw stun and follow. But I have to admit that I got the proof that I posted on the forum from a Byrne book (Complete book of pool shots. 350 moves every player should know. Published in 2003).